Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Moderators: greenyellow, UOducksTK1

Post Reply
User avatar
Phalanx
Senior
Posts: 3899
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:50 pm

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by Phalanx »

oregontrack wrote:
you don't let your franchise star hit the market. i'm sorry, i'm a little taken aback by this. i've never met anyone who has questioned the blazers for locking up lillard long term.

sure. and blazers seemed to waver on matching new jersey's offer sheet before deciding to do so. as i've said, it was a jarring amount of money for a role player, but i've since decided (as portland no doubt did at the time) that they wouldn't be able to sign anybody better with the money, so might as well take care of your own and continue to develop a young talent. you clearly don't think it was the right call. that's okay. unlike the decision to re-sign lillard to the max, the crabbe decision has proven to be pretty controversial.


again, lillard didn't make the all star team because A.) he's not curry, westbrook, or paul, and B.) it's partially a fan vote, and the fans wanted to see kobe bryant. he landed on the All NBA team, which is much more significant than an all star berth.

telling lillard "you aren't worth what we can afford to pay you, we'll let the market decide" is a GREAT way to alienate your star player, and tell any agents and players who might *ever* consider us that we're cheap bastards who don't take care of our own. nobody does this.



i agree with the notion that players are replaceable.


which is a proven, time-tested failure. which is why they matched the offer sheet for crabbe. we DO test free agency. all the time. and we whiff, hardcore. every time.


if the equation is luxury tax = contender, then fine. the blazers won't be contending this year. as a small market team who cannot, nor will they ever, sign a lucrative free agent, there is only one method to contend: luck the hell out in the draft and get yourself a few generational talents to build around (and win for awhile, then watch them bolt -- i see you there, oklahoma city). instead of putting on a fire sale and condemning the franchise and its fans to 20-win seasons and a permanent spot in the draft lottery for the foreseeable future, the powers that be chose to keep a fun, energetic collection of young talent together and watch it grow. are you a blazer fan? honest question. if you are, CHAMPIONSHIP OR BUST should never be your priority.

they may never be a true contender, but i have a hard time getting behind an annual tanking effort.
The funny thing about reading your arguments is that we can see the result of this philosophy - the Blazers aren't good. They're being payed like they are one of the top teams in the NBA, but they aren't even close. They also now have almost no flexibility for trades, and they will be just good enough every year to get a terrible draft pick. I see you carrying a lot of water for these decisions, answering everyone who brings it up, but you simply can't argue your way past reality. These guys aren't good enough to justify the salaries they are being paid. Last year, there was the hope that improving pieces for possible trades and cap room would translate into roster improvement. This year, most of that hope is gone. Nobody is going to trade for Crabbe with that salary. Nobody wants Turner for that much cap hit. Harkless, Leonard, McCollum...none of these guys were worth the money they were paid. They would have to improve by leaps and bounds to become tradeable assets.

To answer your question, I am a Blazer fan; I grew up watching Drexler, Porter, Kersey, Buck Williams, etc. That team was built mostly from the draft, and as the Schonze used to say, they were the best starting five in the NBA. A decade later, Bob Whitsett did a lot of trading and took advantage of Sabonis finally coming to the NBA, and we got another great team, albeit somewhat flawed in character. It can be done. Just not the way Olshey is doing it now. I'm sure he is very popular with the players, but as a fan, I think he had an awful offseason. Anyone can overpay players. That isn't what makes a GM good. The good ones get the players to buy into a vision so that they will take a little less to play on a good team.

Re: Free Agency - I think you are still not getting my argument. Obviously, Portland has a hard time bringing in the top free agents. That wasn't what I was talking about. I am talking about not throwing star money at a less talented player like Turner, I am talking about letting Crabbe be overpaid by someone else, and I am talking about letting Leonard and Harkless go out and find out there is no money left because all of the good players were already signed. The funny thing is, Olshey already proved that all of these guys are replaceable, and then he turned around and payed them as if they weren't.
oregontrack
All Pac-12
Posts: 5118
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:23 pm

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by oregontrack »

no, i get your point, i just don't necessarily agree that they were bad moves is all (with my continued objection of overpaying turner; that seemed like a textbook case of bidding against ourselves). i like the idea of keeping an exciting, overachieving young core together. i think time has proven we would not have spent the money on anyone worthwhile from the outside the organization.
ImageImageImageImageImage
User avatar
Phalanx
Senior
Posts: 3899
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:50 pm

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by Phalanx »

oregontrack wrote:no, i get your point, i just don't necessarily agree that they were bad moves is all (with my continued objection of overpaying turner; that seemed like a textbook case of bidding against ourselves). i like the idea of keeping an exciting, overachieving young core together. i think time has proven we would not have spent the money on anyone worthwhile from the outside the organization.
When they were hungry, it was easier to overachieve. Now that they have their contracts, I think it very likely we will see them settling into that 8th seed sweet spot where teams go to die. With the 19th pick every year and a limited ability to trade thanks to their new luxury tax status, the Blazers are pretty much stuck in mediocrity and far less interesting than they were last year.
User avatar
UOducksTK1
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 37590
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:28 pm
GM: Boston Celtics GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by UOducksTK1 »

Loss to Suns was sad.

Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
oregontrack
All Pac-12
Posts: 5118
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:23 pm

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by oregontrack »

nice wins @ dallas, @ memphis, and at home against the suns. defense took a nice turn in the road games; we had to outscore the suns. we'll always have trouble defending quick, slashing teams like phoenix.

harkless has come to play the last few outings, which really helps balance us out.

our mini win streak will likely come to end tonight @ the clips, but then we return home for 3.
ImageImageImageImageImage
User avatar
UOducksTK1
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 37590
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:28 pm
GM: Boston Celtics GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by UOducksTK1 »

While it's early, you could make an argument for the Clippers being the best team in the NBA.

Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
oregontrack
All Pac-12
Posts: 5118
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:23 pm

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by oregontrack »

ehhhh they're still the clippers, i'm pretty sure they could go 82-0 and still fail to get to the WCF.
ImageImageImageImageImage
User avatar
UOducksTK1
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 37590
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:28 pm
GM: Boston Celtics GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by UOducksTK1 »

oregontrack wrote:ehhhh they're still the clippers, i'm pretty sure they could go 82-0 and still fail to get to the WCF.
Ha, I can't deny that. But man did they destroy Portland last night. While Portland is a fun team to watch, we are SOOO dependent on scoring from the outside. When we are hitting (6-30), we get bullied around by more physical teams. Definitely an off game for Lillard too.

Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
User avatar
UOducksTK1
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 37590
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:28 pm
GM: Boston Celtics GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by UOducksTK1 »

Jimmy Butler.

Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
User avatar
pudgejeff
Senior
Posts: 4897
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 6:21 am
GM: Sacramento Kings GM

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by pudgejeff »

UOducksTK1 wrote:Jimmy Butler.
What about him?
User avatar
Phalanx
Senior
Posts: 3899
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:50 pm

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by Phalanx »

pudgejeff wrote:
UOducksTK1 wrote:Jimmy Butler.
What about him?
He hopes to some day get paid as much as Allen Crabbe.
User avatar
UOducksTK1
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 37590
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:28 pm
GM: Boston Celtics GM
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by UOducksTK1 »

Phalanx wrote:
pudgejeff wrote:
UOducksTK1 wrote:Jimmy Butler.
What about him?
He hopes to some day get paid as much as Allen Crabbe.
:lol:

He beat up on Portland. Had game highs in points, rebounds, and assists. I admire his game.

Do Not Fear. Isaiah 41:13
User avatar
Duck07
All-American
Posts: 15952
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:36 am
Location: Parts Unknown

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by Duck07 »

They look like they need Wes Matthews. I wonder in hindsight what resigning him would have done with other moves?
Image
User avatar
Phenom
All Pac-12
Posts: 9920
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:49 am

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by Phenom »

Duck07 wrote:They look like they need Wes Matthews. I wonder in hindsight what resigning him would have done with other moves?
They need a lot more than Wes Matthews and have little cap flexibility. Bad offseason.
User avatar
Phenom
All Pac-12
Posts: 9920
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:49 am

Re: Portland Trail Blazers Thread

Post by Phenom »

Look at these contracts. How can you not want to barf?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/POR.html
Post Reply