Re: Lyerla in trouble again
Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:19 am
Its not his fault .. until he got to Oregon and had all the help in the world, after that anything is on him. Making excuses for someone helps nobody.
Oregon Ducks Sports Message Board Forum
http://www.ducksattack.com/forum/
Handsome Dan wrote:Is there more detail on that? How involved were the professionals, which kinds, and so forth? I'll definitely concede that I'm not well aware of how things went at Oregon, but with what you gave me I can't be sure if they actually got him the help he needed.lmduck wrote:Dan- many, many people at Oregon tried to help Colt. Many went way above and beyond using personal resources. Many people including MH sought help and guidance from professionals for Colt. Colt was given way more opportunities than others. To say he has been failed by many people is a very inaccurate statement. Yes, there certainly are some family members who have failed him, but I can tell you MANY people at UO attempted to help this guy multiple times. He chose not to take advantage of it.Handsome Dan wrote:He needs treatment, not judgement. He's been failed by many people along the way, starting with his parents. It's a shame Helfrich didn't understand how to handle him properly, because his time at Oregon was the best opportunity for a successful intervention.
This is very, very incorrect.Alan wrote:Who to blame? His mom? No doubt the blame lays on him...sad and yes, he's probably not done making headline, just sad.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Also note that I'm not saying they intentionally failed him; that'd be highly questionable given Helfrich's personality and ludicrous after what you wrote here. But trying to help someone and actually helping them aren't the same thing.
Maybe he does want it but feels trapped in a hopeless morass he can't escape? I'm not sure it's the best idea to tell me that no one knows what Colt is dealing with and then three sentences later make a statement that implicitly contradicts it (you can't say something is "clearly" without presuming to know with a lot of certainty).Alan wrote:You know as little as anyone of us know about what Colt is dealing with. How many interventions does it take? Colt is the one making the choices he makes, numerous people have reached out, including the legal system..... he was on parol when he go busted. There's a good chance in 10 years we'll read a story about how "once football star got lost in drugs and was found dead". I'm not saying it's too late for help, I'm saying Colt has got to want it for it to work......he clearly doesn't want it.Handsome Dan wrote:He needs treatment, not judgement. He's been failed by many people along the way, starting with his parents. It's a shame Helfrich didn't understand how to handle him properly, because his time at Oregon was the best opportunity for a successful intervention.
This is very, very incorrect.Alan wrote:Who to blame? His mom? No doubt the blame lays on him...sad and yes, he's probably not done making headline, just sad.
Regarding the legal system, it's not necessarily the best at getting mentally unhealthy people the treatment they need.
I don't think you understand how much damage a bad upbringing can have on someone, or why someone might choose the "easy" way out when they're mired in a cycle of misery and hopelessness. You seem insistent on blaming Colt without considering the complexity of the situation, which I'd argue is taking the easy way out in regards to providing an opinion on this issue.OregonFan4Life wrote:You're actually the one that's very very incorrect. I may not have liked Helf as a coach but he handled this right, and so did Chip. Colt's problem is he refuses to listen to anyone and he avoids addressing the fact that he has problems. I have a lot of insight as to Colt while he was at the UofO, there was a reason he had the nickname "Coke" Lyerla. He also caused a lot of trouble in bars and almost always needed to be escorted by bouncers. I do feel bad for Colt's upbringing, but he has had all the resources to clean himself up and have a very successful career in the NFL, but instead he keeps choosing the easy route and doesn't work to better himself. There's nobody but Colt to blame for that.Handsome Dan wrote:He needs treatment, not judgement. He's been failed by many people along the way, starting with his parents. It's a shame Helfrich didn't understand how to handle him properly, because his time at Oregon was the best opportunity for a successful intervention.
This is very, very incorrect.Alan wrote:Who to blame? His mom? No doubt the blame lays on him...sad and yes, he's probably not done making headline, just sad.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'll just leave some questions here for you to think about:
1. Why did Colt not listen to anyone and refuse to admit he has a problem?
2. Why did he develop a hard drug habit in high school?
3. Why did he have obvious issues containing his anger?
In other words, what do you think could be responsible for all those bad behaviors you identified?
Except people have acknowledged that some of his issues do stem from past events and people in his life. It's just that they realize those only explain a small part of why he continues down this path of self-destruction. It also seems you glossed over those who have said they have dealt with people suffering from addiction and know what it encompasses in order to take a swipe at several other posters because they have a different viewpoint than Dan and you.Pontius wrote:I appreciate your posts in this thread Handsome Dan. I think your understanding of reality runs circles around that of others. People who refuse to accept complexity and blame personal failures on the individual have a severe myopic tendency. They really have no concept or understanding of the complexity of cause and effect.
I don't think anyone denies that addiction is a complex issue. To say otherwise is naive. It is also completely naive to ignore the personal responsibility portion of it as well.greenyellow wrote:Except people have acknowledged that some of his issues do stem from past events and people in his life. It's just that they realize those only explain a small part of why he continues down this path of self-destruction. It also seems you glossed over those who have said they have dealt with people suffering from addiction and know what it encompasses in order to take a swipe at several other posters because they have a different viewpoint than Dan and you.Pontius wrote:I appreciate your posts in this thread Handsome Dan. I think your understanding of reality runs circles around that of others. People who refuse to accept complexity and blame personal failures on the individual have a severe myopic tendency. They really have no concept or understanding of the complexity of cause and effect.
Agreed. I was just correcting Pontius on his assertion that only Dan (sorry to pick on you a bit) was open-minded on the factors affecting drug addiction.Duck24 wrote:I don't think anyone denies that addiction is a complex issue. To say otherwise is naive. It is also completely naive to ignore the personal responsibility portion of it as well.greenyellow wrote:Except people have acknowledged that some of his issues do stem from past events and people in his life. It's just that they realize those only explain a small part of why he continues down this path of self-destruction. It also seems you glossed over those who have said they have dealt with people suffering from addiction and know what it encompasses in order to take a swipe at several other posters because they have a different viewpoint than Dan and you.Pontius wrote:I appreciate your posts in this thread Handsome Dan. I think your understanding of reality runs circles around that of others. People who refuse to accept complexity and blame personal failures on the individual have a severe myopic tendency. They really have no concept or understanding of the complexity of cause and effect.
I agree with you and Dan. I suffered from addiction for decades before finally discovering my faith. It's my personal opinion that unless someone has actually "experienced it themselves", you know absolutely nothing about it. Not trying to be a jerk, just stating a fact.Pontius wrote:I appreciate your posts in this thread Handsome Dan. I think your understanding of reality runs circles around that of others. People who refuse to accept complexity and blame personal failures on the individual have a severe myopic tendency. They really have no concept or understanding of the complexity of cause and effect.
They explain a lot more than "a small part" though. He continues down the path of self-destruction because he's trapped in something (heroin addiction) he can't escape by himself, and he's trapped in it because he's trying to deal with an incredibly nasty accumulation of negative emotions that started when he was young, kept building on each other (just try to imagine dealing with the knowledge that your NFL dream, which you were banking on to escape your childhood, was dead because of your childhood), and were never properly treated. He needs exactly what SuperDuck says he needs - a happy, positive, and safe environment where he can go through that process of reconstruction successfully. It does no good for anyone to sit here and try to heap an unfair amount of judgement and blame on him for his predicament.greenyellow wrote:Except people have acknowledged that some of his issues do stem from past events and people in his life. It's just that they realize those only explain a small part of why he continues down this path of self-destruction. It also seems you glossed over those who have said they have dealt with people suffering from addiction and know what it encompasses in order to take a swipe at several other posters because they have a different viewpoint than Dan and you.Pontius wrote:I appreciate your posts in this thread Handsome Dan. I think your understanding of reality runs circles around that of others. People who refuse to accept complexity and blame personal failures on the individual have a severe myopic tendency. They really have no concept or understanding of the complexity of cause and effect.
You go quickly from saying it's opinion to saying it's fact lol. I'm assuming you were trying to soften it by saying first that it was your opinion, but since you're right, you shouldn't need to. Maybe inject a bit of nuance into the part about knowing absolutely nothing (there is the possibility to imagine, which is something even though it is obviously "inferior" to experiential knowledge) if you'd prefer to take the edge off instead.SuperDuck wrote:It's my personal opinion that unless someone has actually "experienced it themselves", you know absolutely nothing about it. Not trying to be a jerk, just stating a fact.
Thanks for trying to be understanding, OF4L. I understand that the UO probably went above and beyond. I have no problem with them whatsoever. As I mentioned in my post, different people are different. Also, timing for some isn't good, as odd as that may seem.OregonFan4Life wrote:Thanks for that post SuperDuck! That definitely puts into a great perspective, perhaps I was a little too rough with my judgment of Lyerla, I will say though that the UofO did give him all the resources he needed to recover, they were kind to him and did not try to make him feel any worse for his issues, and it was him that said no. So I do feel there is an aspect of him not realizing the magnitude of his problems, but who am I to judge? I will admit to getting defensive when I hear people attack the University or say they didn't help him, cause that isn't true. I certainly hope Lyerla finds himself and fully recovers.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk